The question of the validity of priestly ordinations today, and the problems of the Society of Saint Pius X
— Theologica —
The question of the validity of priestly orders today, AND THE PROBLEMS OF THE FRATERNITY OF SAINT PIUS X
The tragic mistake which is fallen Bishop Marcel Lefebvre, certainly due to a subtle deception of the devil, was formed in his mind an adamant as mistaken belief, that the teachings of the Council, He appeared to be polluted by a secularist mentality, anthropocentric and modernist, They consequently compromise the high, traditional dignity of Holy orders, degrading it and asservendola to profanity, at depths, Not to mention the mistakes of the modern world.
Author
John Cavalcoli OP
Glossy photograph of the situation.
And he said to them: This kind can come out in nothing but prayer and fasting
After a long day on Sunday (three masses in two parishes, confessions and various meetings) I read before going to rest in peace with God the father John's article and the article by Fr. Ariel provocatively titled “Saints obnoxious” … brilliant both !!
In addition to sleep in peace with God go to sleep even at peace with my conscience, because his article father John pulled off what many of us think of priests, but we don't have the courage and in preparing part two patmosiani fathers to express certain problems that, before salmon, real are woefully.
Thanks father John for giving me with this article … a restful night and a perfect ending …
Caro Father, reading the articles his father and Ariel returns me to mind Saint Paul when he says: “Welcome among you who is weak in faith, without discussing this hesitation. One believes he can eat anything, the other instead, that is weak, eats only vegetables. He who eats not despise those who do not eat; those who do not eat, don't misjudge who eats, because God took him”.
I read your writings for years, Although I have never intervened on the island of Patmos, I follow by October 2014. I read his book on Rahner and the book of father Ariel “Satan became the triune God”, and by reading I got this idea: Surely you are very dedicated to the Ministry of confession. I've never read a line in which you accused the weak, sinners, for which you always have words of understanding and comfort. You're hard on the “strong”, or with those for role and believe they have strong position. You attacked those who “they eat” and despise “those who do not eat”, accusing the mangioni and defending the one who fasts.
Maybe I am weak in faith, but I have faith. Butter, instead, would you be able to eat a bull bites, I can only eat cooked apples.
Article degree, his latest, which can be written only by one who first takes the bull by the horns, then, If the bull does not stand still, takes to morsi.
I tell you though that I, in my small, I dared not go to orders made by my Bishop over the past 11 year old, having ordered 13 subject one worse than the other, and I'm not say at what levels “worst”, since they, the cases described by her nerd, they all recur, Indeed it seems that he wrote his article taking these subjects as standard.
Groom all that wrote, Rev.mo the father, and while she continues with Don Ariel to bulls bite, I, in my small, I have to limit myself to use the forces that I, eating baked apples.
A sincere thank you for the comfort that you both give us.
Don Antonio T.
Dear Don Stefano,
his letter confirms, If there was need, that with my article, as it were, I did “center”.
We speak today more than ever of the causes of nullity of marriage, but too little grounds for invalidity of priestly ordinations, but then to be assured training priests or rahneriana or scillebexiana you want to treat or to presume to be causes or issues of matrimonial nullity and to claim to advise or guide couples in crisis.
Poor couples who fall into their hands! It happens then that these priests, they should first correct oneself, you maybe atteggino to masters of spirituality and guides charismatic prophetic, and woe to anyone who disagrees with them!
I am convinced that the gravissmo problem of homosexuality or pedophilia in priests have deeply rooted in misconceptions on the priesthood, tolerated by the Bishop, assuming that he is himself Orthodox, While it would have been too late to correct or to dismiss the seminarian undisciplined.
The priest convinced of his vocation and who knows how to taste the joys of the priesthood, Certain, as a sinner, is always in need of purification, but do not think to subside in some vile carnal pleasures and manages to win easily these degrading temptations.
What mind and does tighten the core, but also provokes outrage, and this is my experience of priest from 40 year old, is that there would be the child and young people willing to take the path of priesthood, but they are discouraged or ridiculed or dismissed from unhealthy and corrupt seminaristici.
But without thinking at such depths, It is disheartening to note the indifference and neglect in many priests for mass and confession, which are the services to the people of God, that only they can play, While engaged in other activities perhaps itself good, but that can be done better by laity.
How many times the recent Magisterium came on the theme of priesthood, In addition to considering the precious documents of the Council! What is missed and that is missing is sufficient zeal in the bishops to promote, boost, support, defend and correct the priestly formation.
A case similar to the one described by you, young heavily harassed by a priest of new generation, came to dishonor the headlines even in my Diocese, but I touched to hear from the mouth of a priest associated with the ancient rite and only “syllabic package” that the Bishop would have had to cover the misdeeds of the harasser and escape to secular jurisdiction (the package is also usually antisiccardiano).
You might think a sanatio in radice made by divine mercy.
Consider perilous. Could not then divine mercy heal in a root marriage built on invalid assumptions?
Dear don Michele,
Thank you for your speech. the case that she has has all appearances to say the signs of being an invalid order.
I believe that the serious question I post go taken seriously. E’ an invitation which I modestly to our bishops and vorreri hope that someone from the Holy See might have noticed.
Of course, as I said, the grace of God works and I think even a priest invalidly ordained, If he repents, It fixes and repairs, yet from God before him that sublime mission, that had initially welcomed or unconscious unfairly based on false ideas and bad intentions. You might think of a healing at the root of the divine mercy.
I think some defections are caused by the fact that the priest realizes that being ordained invalidly, or never having been a priest. The bishops should take more care to ensure on this point on their seminarians preparing for priesthood.
Reverend Father John dear.
I am a priest of 65 years which 20 years ago he was sent as curate a newly ordained priest, corresponding, roughly, the subject described by don Michele. Were nightmarish months, also because I lived with eyes open, especially when it came in contact with adolescents and young people.
The bomb exploded when the negai bring summer the Group of young males in the parish on camping.
The Bishop asked me account, and I expressed my reasons. When Bishop tried to force me to allow the curate to bring young camping, I told him that in that case I instantly was resigning as pastor.
He accepted my resignation immediately and sent me to make the chaplain in prisons.
Six years later the priest, denounced by three sets of parents, He was arrested for sexual harassment against children (14, 15 e 17 year old).
The Bishop publicly stated before, the Magistrates then, not aware of anything, and that he was physically impossible to have all the priests and parishes under control.
I introduced myself to the Prosecutor's Office and said that he has informed the Bishop six years before, with the result ending up in prison chaplain, where I've been happily and I always have a great beautiful memory, I still get today after many years of visits ex-convicts.
At that point I had to find another diocese who accepted me. I found her, and I incardinò the Bishop in his diocese he sent me to a country parish.
In this diocese are from 14 year old, where I saw young priests, similar to those described by don Michele, become pastors of the largest parishes. Today I care 4 small country parishes that comprise about 1200 faithful in total.
My former Bishop remained in Office until the 75 year old, continuing to say that he was not informed and that, the priest who had “maligned” in the courts (IE I) He was just angry with him for being sent to make the chaplain in prisons.
That's all.
I confirm, Unfortunately, the diversity of individual cases, to have known 25 years of priesthood several cases identical in substance to the bottom.
I would also like to know the opinion of father John Carlson.
Dearest Father Giovanni Cavalcoli,
how much and how often I post, silently, the question whether certain orders (We say especially “scandalous”) were valid! E’ that the issue is so delicate that it is not easy to talk about it.
A case to explain: one of my previous bishops (I belong to one of those dioceses of “step” where the permanence of bishops is 4 years maximum) ordered an item that was devoid of these requirements
1. It was not a “healthy man” because not only blatantly effeminate (always unseemly thing for a priest, whether or not homosexual) because of its ones attracted to the same sex, and all we knew.
2. Had a misconception of the sacraments.
3. Had a Calvinist idea of Eucharist that considered “the Lord's Supper”
4. He said that in extreme cases one cannot speak of euthanasia, because before certain terminally ill, which can not be avoided suffering, What is called “euthanasia” It is an act of charity.
5. The same logic applied to abortion, stating that there were very specific cases which were assessed, and as an example with fetuses carried serious malformations and women raped.
6. He said that if the Church had revised the Humanae vitae, through contraception would have avoided many abortions
etc, etc …
Aware of all, e, informed by priests, the Bishop agreed to order it to cover his predecessor and other edifying situations, avoiding the outbreak of a major scandal.
It was clear to everyone that
1. the Bishop ordered under blackmail, so I dread to think what kind of mental reserves had, He knows that his consciousness.
2. the candidate became a priest with the wrong idea of the priesthood and for reasons which have nothing to do with the priestly Ministry.
3. the candidate became a priest without a correct perception of the Catholic faith.
At his ordination, took part 39 priests, but only 21 they were part of our Diocesan clergy comprises in total from 114 secular and regular priests.
When many of us, pastors from 20, 30, 40 year old, lamentammo the Bishop appointed him two years after ordination, pastor of the Cathedral Church, We was told we were “jealous” e “envious”.
A few months later, in our Cathedral Church, they did the following:
1. Enzo Bianchi's preaching on Ecumenism, with explanation that all religions can bring salvation and that being Catholic means follow one of the ways of salvation
2. a Conference “Pastora” in the presence of our Pentecostal charismatics to treat the theme “the holy spirit that unites us” and concluding prayer … “Shaman” dancing (How would that biting pen don Ariel) the Holy Spirit under the Chair of the Bishop.
3. don Luigi Ciotti Conference on the concept of legality (not appointed Christ once).
4. reading a rehash of the Gospel of the passion “rewritten” e “starred” four actors Theatre three atheists, a representative of the new age, two of the three male actors were openly homosexual and part of Jesus was recited by women.
5. dance on the night of Palm Sunday to the music of Jesus Christ Superstar, even then with a ballet company composed mostly of homosexual dancers.
Try to take at face value that what I presented is true, the wonder, father Giovanni, she, would have some doubt about the validity of this ordination?
Father Michael