The diaconate to women? Some speak of “reset”, but how can you restore what never existed?
THE WOMEN DIACONATE? It IS ABOUT TO "TALK RECOVERY ', BUT HOW CAN RESTORE WHAT HAS NEVER EXISTED?
Among riots of Catholic journalists “committed” and feminist theologians who already shout “victory!”, the televisions are talking and titrating newspapers that "Pope Francis opened the diaconate to women '. I would have much to say about Catholic journalists “committed” and the feminist theologians who I respect very worst of seven plagues of Egypt and who are already speaking and writing of 'recovery' of the female diaconate ", which they say "existed in the first centuries of the Church's life", while in truth none of this ever existed.
– Theologica –
Author
Ariel S. Levi di Gualdo
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PDF print format: on study female diaconate (15.02.2010)
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The Supreme Pontiff, in one of its expressions arm, he returned to raise yet another hornet's nest, before which one wonders: in launching certain jokes that in a few minutes then they do around the world filling the pages of newspapers, our August Pontiff, You can not fully realizing what he says, or maybe it makes the other hand account? The answer to such a question is in the consciousness, that only God can read.
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The Holy Father has a habit - in my opinion misleading - To be interviewed by journalists and allow people ask him questions at point blank range in public settings; and are often focused on questions of extraordinary delicacy issues that can not be answered with a joke more or less telegraphic. Neither can be answered in improvised and vague, because none of us is omniscient; and philosophical disciplines, theological, historical, legal, They are so complex and complicated that even the Vicar of Christ on earth can know every science all that knowledge.
But first of all let's see what really happened: during the meeting with the Supreme Pontiff of the Union of Superiors Major "consecrated presented the issue of the opening of the permanent diaconate to women, with reference to the early Church. Francis said that the ancient role of deaconesses is not still very clear and said he was willing to be of interest to the issue of a Commission study ' [see text on Vatican Radio, WHO]..
The Holy Father did not give an answer, He replied saying he was "willing to be of interest to the issue of a Commission study '. But within a few hours, including dances, Catholic journalists “committed” and feminist theologians who already shout “victory!”, the televisions are talking and titrating newspapers that "Pope Francis opened the diaconate to women '. I would have much to say about Catholic journalists “committed” and the feminist theologians who I respect very worst of seven plagues of Egypt and already they are talking and writing about the 'recovery' of the female diaconate ", which they say "existed in the first centuries of the Church's life", while in truth none of this ever existed.
I am very pleased that the Supreme Pontiff, answering, it is in a sense put the shelter stating: "The ancient role of the woman deacon is still not very clear». I am equally pleased that he decided to make even this is answered, as in the past it was given to the demands on priesthood to women; and the answer was that we remember the following:
"Therefore, in order to remove any doubt about a matter of great importance, it pertains to the divine constitution of the Church, in virtue of my ministry of confirming the brethren, I declare that the Church It does not in any way to confer priestly ordination on women and that this judgment is to be held definitively by all the Church's faithful " [2]
The answer was "no" with finality. I take this opportunity to explain what is meant in dogmatic theology with defining e definitive. The way defining It is expressed through the dogma and imply the infallibility. The way definitive It is expressed when the Pope proceeds to "confirm his brothers in faith" [cf. LC 22,32]. In both cases, both expressing themselves through definitive magisterium both through the magisterium definitional, he expresses himself infallibly [3]. .
Incidentally: as always we invite you to go to the sources and never to rely on “heard” and the evil of the newspapers interpretations, then read the official text which is quoted in full the interview of the Holy Father with the religious (cf. WHO).
Not having had no direct wire with the Supreme Pontiff nor with his close associates, seeing that he intends to appoint a study commission, I wish to make it available as of now already done a study on this issue, which is precisely the study my. This study I published in February 2010 farfetched to refute a statement of Cardinal Carlo Maria Martini, which it was hoped, just as today they hope Catholic journalists “committed” and feminist theologians who I respect very worst of seven plagues of Egypt, the "restoration" of what the Church is the East and the West has never existed: the female diaconate. What I explain in this study already revived in December 2014 on the columns of Theologica of the island of Patmos.
the Island of Patmos, 13 May 2016
Blessed Virgin Mary of Fatima
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To read the study, click below:
Ariel S. Levi di Gualdo – STUDY DIACONATE FEMALE
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NOTE
[1] Dogmatic constitution The light n. 25 e Doctrinal Note on the Concluding Formula of profession of faith the 18 May 1998, n. 8.
[2] priestly ordination the 22 May 1994
[3] To protect the faith, 18 May 1998.
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“the philosophical disciplines, theological, historical, legal, They are so complex and complicated that even the Vicar of Christ on earth can know every science all that knowledge”
Fair Enough. We have a Pope who speaks without thinking… For this father Ariel has accompanied her photo article 'deaconesses’ I suppose an Anglican or Lutheran ugliest of the other… At this point the Pope just look at them, and understand NOW – without engaging in historical reflections, philosophical or theological too complex for Him – so bad that women can not be ordained deacon… On the contrary, This will make him remember that females the immortal soul was infused – as he well knew St. Thomas – almost two months after that to males… e – in conclusion – intuirà immediately that the diaconate to women should be denied!
“… St. Bernard of Clairvaux, in which the great Father and Doctor of the Church suggested to the cardinals to elect Pope not the holiest candidate, and not even the most educated, but the most prudent”
Caro Orion,
I suppose that you are the current pope (in March 2013) is (perhaps!) the holiest and / or the most educated, but certainly not the most prudent…
Dear Reader.
Since the island of Patmos we have the prince of stomp, we leave the answer to the Dominican Giovanni Cavalcoli …
Ariel expensive gift,
I heard with my own ears, from the mouth of “Catholics involved”, statements like “The Pope signed the decree for the ordination of deaconesses”, accompanied by joy and gladness.
People unacquainted? Undoubtedly,
But the fact is that this is just the latest in a long series of papal utterances that for three years now generate confusion in the Church, confusion that is there for all to see.
My good Don Ariel, she is a priest who certainly knows his stuff, so I know better than that famous letter of St. Bernard of Clairvaux, in which the great Father and Doctor of the Church suggested to the cardinals to elect Pope not the holiest candidate, and not even the most educated, but the most prudent.
E, God forgive my arrogance, but I can not help but think that the cardinals gathered in conclave 2013 they did the exact opposite of what was suggested by the Doctor Mellifluus…
Always pioneering German,
PARADE OF DRESSES FOR LITURGICAL "deaconesses". WHEN THE DECLINE OF A CHURCH TURNS INTO FARCE headline now the Helm, recovering a service of 2014 of Focus.de
http://www.iltimone.org/30620,News.html
Attentive to the diaconate to women. Let us remember that the soul (not the vegetative and sensitive) But the intellectual soul is created by God in man on the fortieth day after conception, but in women the ninetieth day… cf. Tommaso, Super Sent., III, (d). 3, q. 5, a. 2… women receive from God the soul almost two months after, and we want to give them the diaconate?
Avant-garde? Here they are ready, punctual:
http://www.lanuovabq.it/it/articoli-diaconesse-ravasi-e-kasper-bruciano-le-tappe-16162.htm
Dear Paola.
Perhaps many readers will expect an answer type so to speak socio-ecclesial, or theological-pastoral. But nothing of what I intend to give if we speak of Germany. So my answer will be all focused on the economy.
The German Catholic Church is the richest in the world. Think, the money that the Italian taxpayers pay through the 8x1000 to the Italian Catholic Church, compared to what they perceive the Germans are really some change.
This wealth is so great and that parishes can afford to pay salaries even the members of the parish council and catechists.
In Rome, I received the sacred orders of the diaconate or priesthood only a few days away from my German colleague, dear friend and fellow student. A few months later, when after the summer he made his return to Rome from Germany and met again, talking about this and that I came to find out that my first “monthly salary” Ente perceived Livelihood Clergy was equivalent to 740 Euro, his was tantamount to 2.860. Along with this “first pay”, German brother also felt all so-called “Extras”, because any pastoral service as well as the administration of certain Sacraments or the celebration of Holy Masses, carrying strict compensation, or if you prefer to offers. So my German colleague was receiving in total, roughly, on 3.400 € per month, no cost of meals, accommodation, supplies payable, etc …
A pastor with 25 years of service, Germany arrives to take, only salary, among the 4.500 ed i 5.000 € per month, totally free of charges.
In the seventies, a single large German parish, was able, thanks to the money then and the disproportionate relationship that existed between the German mark and the currencies of other countries, to maintain alone an entire missionary diocese of Brazil or Colombia.
And that said, someone still ask why, Liberation Theology, It was born in the North of Europe and was then incubated by German theologians between Brazil and many other countries of Latin America?
Germany, below followed by the United States of America, It has always been the largest contributor to the Holy See; in recent times has been added, as a great contributor, the Catholic Church of Korea, which it is also rich, He not surprisingly received the apostolic visit of the last Popes, including the reigning Pontiff.
What it is called IOR, the Institute of Religious Works, the so-called Vatican Bank, in fact a German bank, because the deposits are in fact all of them at a Frankfurt bank. So we can say that the Germans, in a sense, “administer” also funds of the Holy See.
After seeing the churches of Germany that I know well, ie liturgical abuses of all sorts, arbitrary discipline of the Sacraments … or worse “bishop” Lutheran Guests during Mass are invited to do the homily on the Gospel … She rightly asks me: "Rome knows everything, and if they know everything, because they have never done anything?».
They have never done anything for the simple fact that the Germans hold the purse strings. And as we know, unfortunately,, for some, God is “one, Trine and … quattrino“!
And if the Holy Father to ask the reproaches, for now it caters exclusively to the Italian clergy; perhaps because it was not informed of the fact that in Italy, not a few pastors of indigent communities, They are forced to ask for help to the old retired parents to pay the electricity bill of the parish house.
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Towards the end of my article that I report you may find some reflections on the German Church:
https://isoladipatmos.com/stage/stanno-buggerando-il-santo-padre-salviamo-pietro-i-peggiori-gattopardi-trasformisti-stanno-giungendo-in-pauperistica-gloria-allepiscopato/
And in this second further comment:
https://isoladipatmos.com/stage/delicata-ma-magistrale-strigliata-del-santo-padre-alla-conferenza-episcopale-tedesca/
father ariel, my daughter is married and lives in Germany where my husband and I go to visit every now and then, especially during the holidays, and during holidays, native type and easter, but also simple Sundays, we went in the churches … “catholic”?
Of course “deaconess”, we have seen ..!!
A few years ago I read a book where he also spoke of Germany, bringing his experience as a priest living in Germany, and the title of that chapter said it all … “a de facto schism”.
I ask then: certainly in Rome they know everything, and if they know everything, because they have never done anything?
Thanks for the answer.
A number of considerations and questions, a small anthology, cultured and summarized from various blogs:
1. Holiness, please, compassion, is already a lot of irons in the fire! A month ago the’love joy, yesterday the Civil unions, Today is already the case to think about women Deacon? Give us time to formulate an intention at a time of prayer!
2. The Jesuits, the only order, between the major, which has no female branch…
3. The church – as an apparatus – discriminates against the female gender? The church – Guided by the Spirit – much the honors: in primis la B.V. Maria “You are she….. and Caterina, and… , and …., and mother teresa, and…
4.New scene of a script,black on white, of members of “St. Gallen Mafia“,after Martini, Danneels, Kasper is now the avant-garde? And the rulings of San JPII?
5. A new inoculated Church of GM seeds, as a remedy to the crisis of Faith and Vocation? A failure according to the fruits of: Argentina,Belgium, Brazil, France, Germany, Italy. Netherlands.. Then see blooms and fruits strictly GMO free, in Africa, China, Pakistan is in ambition negletti… also in Europe and the Americas.
The list is still long.
Lord have mercy on us all.
Unfortunately, sig. Bazzorini, I'm afraid she does not recognize a man of God. I tell him as a priest of the Oratory of S. Filippo Blacks, saint whose father Ariel is devoted, several times he appointed in his articles.
The life of S.P. Filippo (he too Tuscan) and charisma of our “family”, teaches me that only real men of God can “making fun” from themselves, and this is a sign of great heart, spirit, theology, pastoral …
God bless her.
P. Raffaele, CO.
Themselves. Bazzorini.
I invoke for her the title of the seat of wisdom!
You are right.
And if you see me in person, He understands what has reduced me insane art of which she accuses me. They are in fact forced to walk down the street with a white cane and a German shepherd on a leash that brings the end of the red cross.
Yet the eye doctor had warned me and told me that sooner or later I would become blind, but unfortunately I did not believe him, and today I pay all the consequences.
Pray for me.
Excellent study of the diaconate to p. Ariel.
What you should do, It is not set up committees to study what is objectively impossible to make women deacons (What we already know), what you should do would be to set up a study committee to see how to put, and also as soon as possible, the laity in their place in the Church, women included.
In utter confusion of roles between priests and laity, with many priests who do the laity and many lay people who do priests (and as well this p. Ariel was very well written and), the only appropriate committee would be the committee that studies how to relocate each of us in his role and in its place.
father Andrea
I will just mention only one of us priests: the models of priestly life and virtue caste that I met in twenty years of priesthood, They were always (and I say: always!) be those who far from making tough and rigorous “pant theology”, toward certain sins and sinners were available and merciful as it is “your Father who is in heaven”.
Father Ariel from the answers, including those ironic, those who have a certain experience, but above all who is a priest, first perceives the ability to love and understanding that comes and derives from the serene and perfect chastity in which this priest lives, because that is what serves chastity of us priests, to love more and more.
The whole, to tell her, that she did not understand anything, and that the problem of this not understanding, unfortunately all that his, not ours.
Since her husband who attends S Vetus Ordo Mass goes also Viados makes adultery and fornication sins no more. Then the divorced and remarried can without any problem going to Communion as the sins of adultery and fornication were abolished by Ariel who does not say it but surely think to be superior to our Lord Jesus Christ. I have already explained that “the art of auto-eroticism” gets hurt because it leads to write such nonsense.
Anna Gent.ma.
No need women to become “deacon” much less “priest”, because with them to be their life and their feminine wisdom can be of help in many other ways.
It p. Ariel deals with things in my opinion the right way, and his way of life is the result of long experience before becoming a priest as an adult. This reason for which we priests turn to him often, ahead of facts and delicate situations that we have not had the opportunity to address and manage, as he has to face and manage. And I know how much he knows what he says, and I know because in his words there is everything, but never irony Free, especially when with two brush barrel depicts certain realities … and I repeat reality, including those of which she was the victim …
father ariel, I kiss your hand, better yet the anointed with precious ointment of spikenard. Rifacendomi his masterful response, I meant to Nonsonobigotto player that I've had most of my life ruined by a husband who militated in Catholic Alliance seeping with Forza Nuova, which was only to Latin Masses that had the word ready against all infidels, including priests. One day I discovered that our accounts were increasingly drying up and many days after hereafter discovered that our money came inside the pockets of Brazilian viados. It was then recognized the nullity of marriage, but in the meantime with one that reasoned just like her I played 20 years of my life, and these lost years will never come again.
Father Ariel allow me to hug her like a daughter and always keep saying bread bread and wine wine!
Anna (Rome)
"Speaking after the photo with coffee 'I suppose strictly served, in that when with cigarette?»
[Ed. https://isoladipatmos.com/stage/amoris-laetitia-la-castita-degli-eretici-e-piu-impura-delladulterio-quel-grande-pifferaio-magico-del-santo-padre-francesco-ha-portato-allo-scoperto-i-topi-e-la-loro-teologia-della-mutanda/ ]
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Dear Reader.
It was not a coffee, but a granita, place that at that time there was, in that area of south-eastern Sicily, a temperature of 39 °, This is the reason why I was dressed in light white dresses.
The next photo I will not at all with the cigarette, ma “posing” with the dazzlingly beautiful Lady Monica Bellucci. And I will make with all due respect to those many “little boys” beauty that, including dances, lace, trine, laces, incense and of the Latins intoxicant, yell "concubines" and "adulterers", only to preserve jealously your calendar in secret Mister Universe posing naked. Because public morality furious are then almost always equated, in disorders and perversions, private immorality.
I guarantee that I can take really more of those various subjects, at the end of the solemn Mass in the ancient rite and at the end of March for Life, then go at night “pilgrims” in the EUR suburbs chasing transvestites and transsexuals, from which inter alia to take rather than dare, only to scream in broad daylight: «Concubine … adultery!».
therefore begin to do the "lay combative", as combative as I have always, towards laymen and unfortunately those not a few priests who scream another's immorality with voices from castrated capons and sculettando as joyous geese.
Amen!
Dear Don Ariel makes me a tenderness, but how can he not realize that the tell-nondico of “revolutionary” (as’ if I have’ all’ friend Scalfari) e’ the result of a preparation that has as its sole objective to confuse and divide still always make news without ever losing the scene to a character that, as confirmed by Dannels , e’ the result of secret meetings with the Bishop of St. Gallen? But I really believe that that “who am I to judge” e’ product of chance? Dear Don SHE’ OVERCONFIDENT (and it shows how EVEN pose at the bar in the preceding article, frankly I would see as the protagonist in a television drama). His article on mice and their THEOLOGY OF PANT does not deserve any comment as those who do not deserve it (with his immense pleasure and to my great regret)appreciated the! Speaking after the photo with coffee’ I suppose strictly served, in that when with cigarette? Obviously make sure you stay away from Ippazia cat could be thrown out as well from the bar …
A LAY battler.